Guest Post: Artist & House of Songs Founder Troy Campbell Reflects on Becoming HAAM Member #001
Recently, artist & The House of Songs founder Troy Campbell sat down with HAAM’s Marketing & Communications Manager Marc Fort for an interview about how and why Robin Shivers started HAAM, how he initially met Robin, and how she taught him - among many other things - how to always dream big and do what you love.
This interview has been lightly edited for clarity.
During the ‘90s, I got a call from my dear friend, Gretchen Barber. I was always working on some weird projects. And she had always tried to help me. I just adored her. And she was always running clubs.
One day she called and she goes, “Troy. I was just at an Austin Music Commission meeting.” It was fairly new, back then in the 1990s. And she was on it.
Gretchen said, “This incredible woman came in (to the Music Commission meeting). She just moved to town. And she has built banks and done all these things. And she’s going to start a music management company. And I was so blown away. I thought of you!”
And I go, “nobody’s gonna want to manage me …”
And she said, “No. No. Not for that. But, you have all this experience. And she seems like she comes from a different world. Maybe you could get a job!” Gretchen knew I was broke.
HAAM founder Robin Shivers and artist Troy Campbell together in HAAM’s early days. Photo provided by Campbell.
And I said, jokingly, “I got all these street smarts! You’re right!”
So I wrote Robin Shivers at her bank. And I asked if I could have an interview with her. And this was me, not knowing how to get a job.
(She agreed to meet me) … and I went up to the 9th floor of this building downtown. and then a secretary greeted me. And Robin walked out, dressed like this badass. And I was super intimidated. I was like, oh my God. Here’s this super cool person … possibly from outer space! Her hair was really big.
And she sits me down. And I was trying to tell her who I was in a really fast way.
She turned around to a file cabinet. Pulled out a red file. Opened it up. And it’s a file on me about the LP “Across the Great Divide,” the album I produced with Michael Hall, which won all these awards.
She said, “Why did you create and produce this album?”
“Because I needed that lady’s (Jo Carol Pierce) songs to be recorded … because I didn’t think she would do it,” I said.
She goes, “Don’t you think that’s kind of a long way to do it?”
“Noooo,” I said.
Then I thought about it and said, “Yeah … kind of.”
Then Robin asked, “Why did you and Michael give the money to the rape crisis center?”
“Because that was something that Jo Carol Pierce believed in and worked on. And it seemed simpler than negotiating all the publishing, which we didn’t understand. It seemed like everybody would be on board if it went to a good nonprofit,” I explained.
“I just think that’s remarkable,” she said.
And I said, “Good. Can you give me a job!”
“Well I plan on managing someone. Someone like Lyle Lovett. I’m impressed by your stuff, but I don’t need anyone right now,” she countered.
So I left, but I called Gretchen. And I hadn’t met anyone in Austin like Robin. She actually knew what she was talking about (around the music business … and beyond.)
A month later, I’m doing all these gigs, trying to survive … at various crap places … playing with my friend Scrappy Jud Newcomb.
And I look at the back of the venue. And there’s this lady who will not look up. And it’s her! And then I walk over to go talk with her, but she’s gone! This happened two or three times.
And Scrappy’s like, “Do you think she’s in love with you or me or something?”
“No, it’s just weird,” I replied. Like, I thought I may be in trouble.
One day later, I got a call. And she was nervous. She said, “I’d like to talk with you. I’d like to talk with you about a business arrangement.”
And I go, “oh … right!”
So she comes over. Sits down. And she has these notes. And she said, “OK. I’ve decided who I am going to manage.”
“Oh good. What can I do to help?” I asked.
“It’s you,” Robin said.
And I go, “Well…what?!”
“There’s a lot of things that need to happen (for this management arrangement to work). And I’ll give you a few rules.”
“I have not said ‘Yes’ yet, Robin,” I said. Because I really didn’t know what was going on.
“First off: I’m not Miss Money Bags. I won’t be giving you any money,” she said flatly.
And a buzzer went off in my head: Buzzzzzzzztt. Wrong answer, Robin.
HAAM Founder Robin Shivers and musician Troy Campbell, circa mid-’90s. Photo courtesy Campbell.
She said, “So I have a couple of questions now.”
“Go for it, you’ve already failed the big one! Which was, ‘How are you gonna get me an apartment? How are you gonna get me from being kicked out of my apartment?”
“Number 1: Why don’t you have health insurance,” she asked. “You and your guitar player Scrappy don’t have health insurance.”
“It’s because we’re poor,” I said. “And when you make us rich, we’ll get health insurance. So what’s your next question?”
“Well, it’s wrong. And we’re going to work on that,” Robin said.
Again, I thought: Buzzzzzzzzttt. Wrong answer.
Her next question was: “Why did you give away all your publishing and lose it?”
And I said, half-joking, “Ma’am, because I’m stupid. Next question.”
And she goes, “That’s wrong. And we’re going to work on getting your publishing back. But you're going to take the time to learn what you did to lose it. And we’re going to make sure you never do that again.”
And her third item was “performances.” She said, “I think you should have more career enhancing performances.” And I didn’t even know what that meant.
And damned if she didn’t start focusing on - not just me - but how she would get health insurance for everyone.
She would say, “I just spoke with so-and-so, and there’s a system that is for children, that is set up for the working poor. I think this model could work. I think we could fit 20+ musicians in it.”
She’d ask, “How do artists survive?”
And I explained how we try not to get hurt. We just try not to have an injury … to the point of being really paranoid and weird about stuff.
“First things first,” she said. “We’re gonna work on this. You’re going to come to my office … three days a week, at lunch. We’ll have lunch for you. And you’re gonna read about publishing for an hour. And my secretary will be watching you.”
And I thought, what have I got to lose? I hate reading, but this person seems serious. And so I went to her office and I read all the books. And I hated it. But I gotta tell you, within a couple of years, we became really close. She started helping my band the Loose Diamonds. And then became really focused on helping me. But, she believed in all of us.
And within the first year and a half of working with Robin, we ended up being in the New York Times as a top 10 critics’ choice record. And she helped make that happen. It was crazy. She was so proud of that because she could show her family.
She did some really subversive things in the years she was working on HAAM. She was constantly experimenting. There were some folks helping Robin in the early days, including John Kunz from Waterloo Records, and some other folks that were really instrumental. They were there, believing in her …
But she was always behind the scenes, building a strategy and building a case. So during that same period, she was going to bat for people like Ray Wylie Hubbard. He was really trying to get a house. But he couldn’t get anyone to give him a loan. So he and Ray’s wife Judy went to Robin - because they knew I liked her and we were friends - and she walked them into a bank, and was able to explain to that bank that his royalties were “x”, and they exponentially would produce “this.” And she had a math equation. And they gave him and his wife Judy a loan to get a house!
So she looked at everything like a business. And I just remember, it was like an old joke. She started bringing up HAAM … that she needed me to go to this clinic. And try this thing out.
And I said, “Hey you know Robin, before you try to put a man on the moon, why don’t you try to put a man in an apartment.” (laughs)
And she just laughed, “Oh Troy ….” But she never flinched.
So … cut to, there were these different experiments. Where she would say, “OK. I got funding for 20 people to get healthcare and do this…and she kept working, and kept growing it!
But that’s how it all got started.
Robin & Bud Shivers. Photo by Todd V. Wolfson.
And I would go to her office. I’d visit Robin and (her husband) Bud Shivers. And she would have things she would run by me. For instance, she said, “What do you think we should call the volunteers at HAAM?”
“Haamsters!” I exclaimed.
“That doesn’t seem very dignified,” she said.
“It’s the best name,” I said. And of course I was joking.
And then they came up with HAAMbasadors.
Once I was speaking with Bud, and getting interviewed about being HAAM patient #001. And I said, “Look. She saw things I couldn’t see. It was only toward the end, where we were working together, that she was really driving home that I had good ideas … yet I needed to go much higher. And dream much bigger. And that I needed to think about how what I’m doing will affect things 50 years from now.”
And that’s why I was so determined while creating the House of Songs. Because I’d made a commitment to her for one year that I would serve … and I would dedicate myself to what I really believe in, which is my love of other artists. And that I would not flinch. And that’s been 12 years now … operating the House of Songs. Working with and operating in 33 countries. And Robin was right. And I still stay the course with Robin’s formula for success.
So many of the things I’ve been able to do, from the House of Songs, to working with Detour Productions and Richard Linklater on music supervision, to being co-creator of Arts + Labor, and starting my own production company: Collection Agency, that was all because of my ability to understand publishing … which she made me learn how to do within the first year of working with her.
When I was at SXSW this year. I went to HAAM’s annual Ray Benson’s Birthday Party after not having been back to Austin in many years. I started to walk in, and there were so many people. There were gates to get in … all these bands playing. So, so many people. I just started to cry while taking it all in. And I walked away for a minute.
… because just around the corner from GSD&M where HAAM’s Ray Benson’s Birthday Party takes place … across the street from Waterloo Records of course … I was overwhelmed with emotion as I recalled the story of the first time she did a HAAM Day. Robin and her friend Valerie - and maybe John Kunz, & Carolyn perhaps was there - all sitting in a car at 5 a.m. And Robin said, “This is so exciting. I hope we receive ‘x’ amount of donations today. But one day y’all, this organization will make $500,000 dollars in one year, sometime in the future.” Today, HAAM has received millions in donations. And when I thought about Robin sitting in that car on the eve of the first HAAM Day. Thinking about her big dreams and her vision coming to fruition, I just burst into tears. I missed her so much.
And I thought, look at how many people have been moved and touched by HAAM. And I realized I needed to walk back into Ray’s Birthday party and thank everyone that I could run into. And I needed to be there for her. Because even though she didn’t want the attention, I needed to acknowledge that she saved my life.
Because I learned from her, I didn’t go around at the event talking about, “Oh, I’m the guy that she started musician healthcare for …” And that’s because from the beginning, she truly did it for everybody.